Sea Breeze

Joined

• started 239 topics
• posted 3,099 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by Sea Breeze

• 
  18

  Jehovah's Witnesses: A Coercive Organization?

  by john.prestor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so in sociology we divide organizations up into three categories or types, you got utilitarian, voluntary, and coercive.

  utilitarian means people join to accomplish some purpose like selling food or making furniture, voluntary means they join up just for fun or to hang out with people like the freemasons or a lot of churches, and coercive means they don't really want to be there but they gotta because someone will punish them if they leave, so labor camps, armies, or prisons.. in a paper i wrote for a class a while back i argued that jehovah's witnesses should be seen as a coercive organization.

  yeah, people join up and they do leave, nobody beats you up if you stop attending or preaching, nobody imprisons you, shoots your dog, kills your kids that kind of thing, and nobody makes you join up either.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  They should be careful what they wish for. The Watchtower is the one being killed off.... one law suit at a time.
• 
  37

  Who is the Saviour?

  by JW Answers in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is for those who are interested in bible study.. the jehovah's witnesses claim that only the father is god, and thus teach he was the saviour in the old testament.

  the bible teaches that god says "there is no saviour beside me".

  therefore how is it, that the lord jesus christ is called the saviour of the world?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  days ofp,

  I think that the views of materialists have made it harder to grasp. JW's have pretty much the same view as materialists: We are just a body with some breath and electrical impulses mixed in.
  
  Probably the vast majority of people on earth, past & present believe differently....that there is something that is immaterial, a consciousness... in addition to the body that constitutes "you".

  There is only ONE "you" , yet you exist in more than one manifestation according to most. Christianity teaches that although God has three manifestations of himself, he is still just one essence, ONE God, not Three.
  
  Jesus replied, "The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord..."

  "Then they asked him, 'Where is your father?' 'You do not know me or my Father,' Jesus replied. 'If you knew me, you would know my Father also'" (John 8:19) "'I tell you the truth,' Jesus answered, 'before Abraham was born, I am!'" (John 8:58). "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30).
  
• 
  37

  Who is the Saviour?

  by JW Answers in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is for those who are interested in bible study.. the jehovah's witnesses claim that only the father is god, and thus teach he was the saviour in the old testament.

  the bible teaches that god says "there is no saviour beside me".

  therefore how is it, that the lord jesus christ is called the saviour of the world?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  It is a little bit silly to assume an infinite, all knowing & omnipresent God and then to imply that he cannot be manifest in the person of Jesus if he wanted to.

  If people exist in three parts spirit, soul and body; and if we are created in his image, why can't God have three manifestations of the same essence?

  The body of Jesus was from his mother. The Spirit of Jesus was the indivisible essence of God.
  
  This understanding explains why Jesus could claim that "all power" had been given him and another time stated that the father was greater than him.
  
  There are other seeming contradicting statements as well that vanish if Jesus was both man & God. At times he spoke from his human nature and at other times he spoke from is divine nature. There is no contradiction here.
• 
  37

  My mom

  by vienne in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i'm annie, rachael's daughter.

  mom died yesterday.

  i can't find a way to delete her account here.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  So sorry for your loss.
• 
  22

  Was Russell "that" Faithful and Wise Servant?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  "from this it is clearly seen that the editor and publisher of zion's watch tower disavowed any claim to being individually, in his person, that "faithful and wise servant.

  " he never did claim to be such," ("god's kingdom of a thousand years has approached," 1973, p. 346).. or this?.

  "thousands of the readers of pastor russell's writings believe that he filled the office of 'that faithful and wise servant,' and that his great work was giving to the household of faith meat in due season.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  Great comments. Thanks!
• 
  5

  Speed Trap

  by TerryWalstrom in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  speed trap (1970).

  i was driving back from a music gig in austin when i hit one of those sneaky highway speed traps.. back then the speed limit on the interstate was 55 mph.. well--suddenly for a quarter mile--it wasn't.. how do i know that?the patrolman who stopped me was kind enough to inform me...as he bid me follow him...to the local justice of the peace...to pay my $50 fine...or else i'd go to jail.. looking back on that episode in my life--i handled it with less wisdom than i now possess.for one thing, i was a bit insensitive.the justice was older than god's socks.

  he may well have been animatronic (you know, like at disneyland).he was deafer than beethoven.. "your honor, there was no reduce speed sign posted along the hi---"he kept interrupting me to ask if i wanted to pay cash or personal check.my remedy was to talk louder.. "your honor, there was...etc".

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  Perhaps you meant 1974?

  Thats when Nixon passed the 55mph speed limit.
• 
  19

  False Predictions

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  what you will not be told at the door bythe jehovah’s witnesses.

  the jehovah’s witness (or watchtower bible and tract society) have made the followingpredictions which appear in their own literature:.

  1. that jesus would return by 1874. when jesus failed to appear, the witnesses claimedthat it was an unseen, spiritual return.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  A couple of relevant memes:

  

  
  
• 
  19

  False Predictions

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  what you will not be told at the door bythe jehovah’s witnesses.

  the jehovah’s witness (or watchtower bible and tract society) have made the followingpredictions which appear in their own literature:.

  1. that jesus would return by 1874. when jesus failed to appear, the witnesses claimedthat it was an unseen, spiritual return.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  What You Will Not Be Told At The Door By
  the JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES

  The Jehovah’s Witness (or Watchtower Bible and tract society) have made the following
  predictions which appear in their own literature:

  1. That Jesus would return by 1874. when Jesus failed to appear, the Witnesses claimed
  that it was an unseen, spiritual return. (Watchtower, Feb. 1881, p 188).

  2. That Jesus would return in 1914 with the Battle of Armageddon ending in October of
  1914 (Zion’s Watchtower, Jan 15, 1892, p.21-23).

  3. That with the end of 1914, what God calls Babylon, and what men call Christendom will
  pass away. (Thy Kingdom Come, 1895, p.153).

  4. When the prophecies of 1914 failed, the new date of 1918 was set for God’s wholesale
  destruction of the church members by the millions. (Finished Mystery, 1917, p.485).

  5. With the failure of this prophecy, a new date of 1925 was set. Therefore we may
  confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob…”
  (Millions Now Living, 1920, p.89-90).

  6. With the expected arrival of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob “any day”, a house was built for them
  in 1930 in San Diego, California and called “Beth Sarim” meaning “House of the Princes”.
  By 1942 it was still “held in trust for the occupancy of those princes on their return”.
  (The New World, 1942, p.104).

  7. In 1941 they claimed that the world was nearing the end and facing “the remaining
  months before Armageddon”. (Watchtower, Sep 15, 1941, 288).

  8. The fall of 1975 was to mark the beginning of Christ’s 1000 year, literal visible reign
  on earth. (Awake! Oct 8, 1968, p.14).

  In March 1968, “there are only about ninety months left before 6000 years of man’s
  existence on earth is completed”. (Kingdom Ministry, March 1968, p.4).

  Dressing well, Sincerity and Zeal do not necessarily indicate the presence of TRUTH.

  
• 
  21

  Perfect response

  by Cerise in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was hoping to get some advice on what to say to a parent who wouldn’t support you to get married to a “worldy person”.

  always bringing up “marry only in the lord” even when that hasnt worked out for the parent, twice divorced lol.

  is there a way to discredit that scripture or argue back respectfully without giving away that you are pimo?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  JW's are not "In Christ" since official WT teaching is that Jesus is not the Mediator for average members. They are not born again by the Spirit of God, only the anointed are according to the WT.

  if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his - Romans 1: 9

  So, your parents advice would actually prevent a person from marrying a JW .
  
  I realize that this is not likely to go over very well.
  
  
• 
  22

  Was Russell "that" Faithful and Wise Servant?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  "from this it is clearly seen that the editor and publisher of zion's watch tower disavowed any claim to being individually, in his person, that "faithful and wise servant.

  " he never did claim to be such," ("god's kingdom of a thousand years has approached," 1973, p. 346).. or this?.

  "thousands of the readers of pastor russell's writings believe that he filled the office of 'that faithful and wise servant,' and that his great work was giving to the household of faith meat in due season.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Sea Breeze

  Thanks ElderEtta!

  Excellent list of descriptions of Russell. Here's more:

  "Pastor Russell was…strong, humble, wise, loving, gentle, just, merciful, faithful, self-sacrificing… As a logician and theologian he is doubtless without a peer today. In his research for Biblical Truth and harmony he is without a parallel in this age. Without a blemish in his character…he towers like a giant unmatched." (The Finished Mystery, p. 125)

  One reseacher estimated over 1300 statements in the book that JW's today would reject today. Yet, the JW book REVELATION ITS GRAND CLIMAX NEAR AT HAND (1988) refers back to the period 1870-1919 and applies the following descriptions to the early JWs:

  anointed Christians, abandoned false doctrines, boldly used the Bible, restoration of true worship, faithful Christians, the John class, God's people, Christ's anointed brothers, faithful and discreet, the Master appointed them, Pure worship was reestablished (p. 209)
  

  This is the same indoctrination and self-glorification that JW leaders promote year after year about the organization, that was once attributed to Russell.
  
  They are really best viewed as two separate cults in my opinion... especially since many Russellites refused to go along with the change to the Organization as God's sole mouthpiece on earth. These were quickly labelled The Evil Slave Class and discarded. One group got control of the printing presses, the other didn't. The rest is history.
  
  But somehow the WT was (and is) able to continue the myth of their origins as a continuation of Russell. Amazing!

  This explains why they were willing to give Russell the FDS title in 1919 but later claimed just the opposite after they stole the FDS mantle from Russell after he died.
  

  They were in fact two heretical groups fighting over ownership of one particularly heresy - the FDS entitlement.